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Originally posted by Anais:

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Originally posted by KGBMan: Typical liberal thinking - we need a government to teach us everything... Who cares what maron sits on some government health thingy - don't use his services and you'll be OK.

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Most likely he will be formulating policy & legislation with my tax money. Also many of those silly liberals....care about people other than themselves..... Anais "And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom." Anais Nin

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Suddenly there is a concern for what happens with an individual's tax money? A bit off of the original topic but...don't conservatives have an equal right to be concerned about what happens with theirs? Most liberals dismiss this complaint when it is coming from conservatives, especially when the funding is going to a liberal supported program. That inconsistency invalidates for me any liberal outrage over what happens with "their" tax dollars. I am also sick of liberal arrogance that presumes to state as a fact that anyone in disagreement doesn't "care about people other than themselves". I though liberals proudly proclaimed to be the party of tolerance...really it is tolerance only if you agree with them. Start showing some consistency of thought and then your arguments might be worth listening to. (Anais, this isn't directed solely at you but you are the one who made the statement so I have included it. I like you and think your intentions are the best but that is twice on this forum that I have read one of your posts implying that only liberals care about other people. I imagine that there are those who do and don't within all parties...and within all other groups of people.)

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Originally posted by Leah:

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Originally posted by Anais:

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Originally posted by KGBMan: Typical liberal thinking - we need a government to teach us everything... Who cares what maron sits on some government health thingy - don't use his services and you'll be OK.

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Most likely he will be formulating policy & legislation with my tax money. Also many of those silly liberals....care about people other than themselves..... Anais "And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom." Anais Nin

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Suddenly there is a concern for what happens with an individual's tax money? A bit off of the original topic but...don't conservatives have an equal right to be concerned about what happens with theirs? Most liberals dismiss this complaint when it is coming from conservatives, especially when the funding is going to a liberal supported program. That inconsistency invalidates for me any liberal outrage over what happens with "their" tax dollars. I am also sick of liberal arrogance that presumes to state as a fact that anyone in disagreement doesn't "care about people other than themselves". I though liberals proudly proclaimed to be the party of tolerance...really it is tolerance only if you agree with them. Start showing some consistency of thought and then your arguments might be worth listening to.

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Certainly everyone is entitled to be concerned about the fate of their tax money..... I don't know what liberals think or argue...but my comment about caring about others was in response to KGB's comment that if one didn't use the services of the Reproductive Health Committee that it needn't be a concern. Anais "And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom." Anais Nin

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Anais, Most likely he will be formulating policy & legislation with my tax money. Since when do you care what happend to your money ? Aren't you supposed to give it all to the government, cause they know better what to do with them ? Also many of those silly liberals....care about people other than themselves..... Most likely they think others can't think for themselfs.

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- Независимость - это когда в 20-й раз наступаешь на одни и те же грабли, а русские уже ни при чем....

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Originally posted by Anais: Great! A religious neanderthal appointed to oversee Reproductive Health. Prayer for PMS!!! Ha! Give me a break!!!! Love to see him tell that to a full on PMS-ing woman...... > Subject: Appointment of Dr. Hager > > President Bush has announced his plan to select Dr. W. David Hager to > head up the Food and Drug Administration's (FDA) Reproductive Health > Drugs Advisory Committee. The committee has not met for more than two > years, during which time its charter lapsed. As a result, the Bush > Administration is tasked with filling all eleven positions with new > members. This position does not require Congressional approval. > > The FDA's Reproductive Health Drugs Advisory Committee makes crucial > decisions on matters relating to drugs used in the practice of > obstetrics, gynecology and related specialties, including hormone > therapy, contraception, treatment for infertility, and medical > alternatives to surgical procedures for sterilization and pregnancy > termination. > > Dr. Hager's views of reproductive health care are far outside the > mainstream for reproductive technology. Dr. Hager is a practicing > OB/GYN who describes himself as "pro-life" and refuses to prescribe > contraceptives to unmarried women. Hager is the author of "As Jesus > Cared for Women: Restoring Women Then and Now." The book blends > biblical accounts of Christ healing women with case studies from > Hager's practice. > > In the book Dr. Hager wrote with his wife, entitled "Stress and the > Woman's Body," he suggests that women who suffer from premenstrual > syndrome should seek help from reading the bible and praying. As an > editor and contributing author of "The Reproduction Revolution: A > Christian Appraisal of Sexuality Reproductive Technologies and the > Family," Dr. Hager appears to have endorsed the medically inaccurate > assertion that the common birth control pill is an abortifacient. > > Hager's mission is religiously motivated. He has an ardent interest in > revoking approval for mifepristone (formerly known as RU-486) as a safe > and early form of medical abortion. Hagar recently assisted the > Christian Medical Association in a "citizen's petition" which calls upon > the FDA to revoke its approval of mifepristone in the name of women's > health. > > Hager's desire to overturn mifepristone's approval on religious grounds > rather than scientific merit would halt the development of mifepristone > as a treatment for numerous medical conditions disproportionately > affecting women, including breast cancer, uterine cancer, uterine > fibroid tumors, psychotic depression, bipolar depression and Cushing's > syndrome. > > Women rely on the FDA to ensure their access to safe and effective drugs > for reproductive health care including products that prevent pregnancy. > For some women, such as those with certain types of diabetes and those > undergoing treatment for cancer, pregnancy can be a life-threatening > condition. We are concerned that Dr. Hager's strong religious beliefs > may color his assessment of technologies that are necessary to protect > women's lives or to preserve and promote women's health. > > Hager's track record of using religious beliefs to guide his medical > decision-making makes him a dangerous and inappropriate candidate to > serve as chair of this committee. Critical drug public policy and > research must not be held hostage by antiabortion politics. Members of > this important panel should be appointed on the basis of science and > medicine, rather than politics and religion. American women deserve no > less. Anais "And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom." Anais Nin

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I can't believe in this! Is this 2004 or we are going back to Middle Ages ???? never say never

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- Доктор, я жить буду?

- А смысл ?

VIV

that is some scary stuff.............so he does not prescribe birth control for unmarried women, or dispense the morning after pill.........so, which one of all these people that are so concerned with my reproductive health will raise all of these poor abused kids, that get shuffled from foster home to foster home, or that are found starved and beaten in a family members basement? "Moral indignation is jealousy with a halo." H.G. Wells

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"Moral indignation is jealousy with a halo."
H.G. Wells

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Originally posted by blonde again: that is some scary stuff.............so he does not prescribe birth control for unmarried women, or dispense the morning after pill.........so, which one of all these people that are so concerned with my reproductive health will raise all of these poor abused kids, that get shuffled from foster home to foster home, or that are found starved and beaten in a family members basement? "Moral indignation is jealousy with a halo." H.G. Wells

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They have a better more dreamily capitalist plan for all those kids..... The Prison Industrial Labor System....... Anais "And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom." Anais Nin

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Originally posted by KGBMan: Anais, Most likely he will be formulating policy & legislation with my tax money. Since when do you care what happend to your money ? Aren't you supposed to give it all to the government, cause they know better what to do with them ? Also many of those silly liberals....care about people other than themselves..... Most likely they think others can't think for themselfs.

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Of course I care what happens in the gov..... with my money..... All this time & you don't know that?? This govt doesn't know better what to do with it that's for sure. Normally I would give money to a govt that was LEGALLY ELECTED....hopefully this govt would be more academic & scientific in it's approach instead of the Diet Decaf Taliban we have in there now... I don't think liberals think that. I think they do really care for others besides themselves. Anais "And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom." Anais Nin

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Originally posted by Anais:

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Originally posted by Leah:

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Originally posted by Anais:

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Originally posted by KGBMan: Typical liberal thinking - we need a government to teach us everything... Who cares what maron sits on some government health thingy - don't use his services and you'll be OK.

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Most likely he will be formulating policy & legislation with my tax money. Also many of those silly liberals....care about people other than themselves..... Anais "And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom." Anais Nin

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Suddenly there is a concern for what happens with an individual's tax money? A bit off of the original topic but...don't conservatives have an equal right to be concerned about what happens with theirs? Most liberals dismiss this complaint when it is coming from conservatives, especially when the funding is going to a liberal supported program. That inconsistency invalidates for me any liberal outrage over what happens with "their" tax dollars. I am also sick of liberal arrogance that presumes to state as a fact that anyone in disagreement doesn't "care about people other than themselves". I though liberals proudly proclaimed to be the party of tolerance...really it is tolerance only if you agree with them. Start showing some consistency of thought and then your arguments might be worth listening to.

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Certainly everyone is entitled to be concerned about the fate of their tax money..... I don't know what liberals think or argue...but my comment about caring about others was in response to KGB's comment that if one didn't use the services of the Reproductive Health Committee that it needn't be a concern. Anais "And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom." Anais Nin

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Anais, My apologies if I misunderstood your intent with the statement about caring about other people. I was busy editing my post yesterday so it didn't sound like a personal attack but was too annoyed to read futher posts on the topic. As for agreeing that everyone has a right to be concerned about the fate of tax money...well, it's a good start. ;) By the way, regarding Dr. Hager, based on the information in the posted article, the only thing on which I agree with him is the orginal topic of this thread...restricting the sale of the morning after pill for purposes of abortion (not other medical purposes) and that is because I believe that there is another entity with rights besides the mother. In his private practice, he has a right to do as he wishes since it is his practice. Certainly, on this committee, he should not attempt to legislate, in any unconstitutional way, his own opinions with regard to women's health issues.

Of course I care what happens in the gov..... with my money..... All this time & you don't know that?? I see, so no objections to giving all of it to goverment (if it is democratic) ? This govt doesn't know better what to do with it that's for sure. Normally I would give money to a govt that was LEGALLY ELECTED....hopefully this govt would be more academic & scientific in it's approach instead of the Diet Decaf Taliban we have in there now... Do people in black suits and black hellicopters bother you ? I don't think liberals think that. I think they do really care for others besides themselves. No, I think my description is more appropriate. Unless you mean care like Dean did, when he didn't call servants servants to protect their fillings

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- Независимость - это когда в 20-й раз наступаешь на одни и те же грабли, а русские уже ни при чем....

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Originally posted by KGBMan: Of course I care what happens in the gov..... with my money..... All this time & you don't know that?? I see, so no objections to giving all of it to goverment (if it is democratic) ? This govt doesn't know better what to do with it that's for sure. Normally I would give money to a govt that was LEGALLY ELECTED....hopefully this govt would be more academic & scientific in it's approach instead of the Diet Decaf Taliban we have in there now... Do people in black suits and black hellicopters bother you ? I don't think liberals think that. I think they do really care for others besides themselves. No, I think my description is more appropriate. Unless you mean care like Dean did, when he didn't call servants servants to protect their fillings

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I think some of it is enough.... I personally don't have that much to start with Yes. People in black suits & black helicopters bother me. The Patriot Act bothers me. Eschelon bothers me. Electronic voting bothers me. The desecration of separation of church & state bothers me..... Big Brother in general bothers me. Dean is a fool. Anais "And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom." Anais Nin

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I think some of it is enough.... I personally don't have that much to start with So, how much of some is enough - 30% ? 50%? 60% ? Yes. People in black suits & black helicopters bother me. The Patriot Act bothers me. Eschelon bothers me. Electronic voting bothers me. The desecration of separation of church & state bothers me..... Big Brother in general bothers me. There are treatments for that, you know Dean is a fool. Yes he is, but didn't you supported him a while ago ? What changed your mind ? "Чем больше женщину мы меньше, тем меньше больше она нас"

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- Независимость - это когда в 20-й раз наступаешь на одни и те же грабли, а русские уже ни при чем....

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Originally posted by KGBMan: I think some of it is enough.... I personally don't have that much to start with So, how much of some is enough - 30% ? 50%? 60% ? Yes. People in black suits & black helicopters bother me. The Patriot Act bothers me. Eschelon bothers me. Electronic voting bothers me. The desecration of separation of church & state bothers me..... Big Brother in general bothers me. There are treatments for that, you know Dean is a fool. Yes he is, but didn't you supported him a while ago ? What changed your mind ? "Чем больше женщину мы меньше, тем меньше больше она нас"

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No, I never supported Dean. I kind of like Kucinich. The tax question is too complex to answer in a short post. Whatever I pay now is alright.... I can say that it shouldn't be used to line Haliburton/Bechtel's pockets.... Anais "And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom." Anais Nin

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with that you are in agreement with the liberal left and cpac... a rare agreement..

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Originally posted by Anais: I can say that it shouldn't be used to line Haliburton/Bechtel's pockets.... Anais "And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom." Anais Nin

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lyosha ****************** What is freedom of expression? Without the freedom to offend, it ceases to exist.

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lyosha
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What is freedom of expression? Without the freedom to offend, it ceases to exist.

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Originally posted by pomidorchik: not only that.. but conservative women themselves want to be controlled...:-) hey..i don't have a prob with that:-)

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First Off, I think Tarzan has the right idea, alot of the shame and stigma of being pregnant out of wedlock has totally disappeared. It has become almost normal to see some high schools pregnant and in class. Remember a few years ago, the scandal in Rockdale county, that was aired on public Television called "the Lost Children of Rockdale County" where a syfilus(sp) epidemic broke out, 150 High School kids all got STD's, they were seen giving each other the High Five at the Public Health Clinic. There was no shame, it had become a badge of honor, so to speak. What would have once brought shame to them, now makes them one of the cool kids? One of the girls talked about how her friend pulled a train, had sex with a large number of boys at a party, and then strutted around the party, as if she were the homecoming queen. "The government makes a lousy parent." excellent comment Tarzan! Leah," For adults, I could agree with all of your arguments but for one problem. No one can prove when a "soul" becomes present. I do not even mean "soul" in strictly religious terms...but rather that spark that makes each of you who you are and different from all others. If there is even the slightest chance that this happens at conception (even before implantation) then I can never support abortion at will." Leah, I agree with you. I don't know when the child becomes a living soul, at what point in the pregnancey? Isaiah the Prophet 44:2 "Thus says the Lord who made you and formed you from the womb" David the Psalmist said "For Thou didst form my inward parts, THou didst weave me in my mother's womb." Psalms 137:9 Anais has a good comment, Big Brother bothers me as well, "Yes. People in black suits & black helicopters bother me. The Patriot Act bothers me. Eschelon bothers me. Electronic voting bothers me." "Big Brother in general bothers me." If you don't like your doctor, find another one, that is pretty simple here in America, instead of moaning and complaining about what he will or won't give you a prescription for, just find another doctor.

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Howard Jones III
SONS OF THUNDER
www.ResurrectedSons.com
Resurrected for a Revolution!!
www.myspace.com/resurrectedsons

I like this Howard Jones guy...He seems to be able to reason with those liberals...I usually just go straight for the jugular...

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Sic semper tyrannis
~War is Peace~Freedom is Slavery~Ignorance is Strength~ George Orwell "1984"